State of the Flash Game Industry

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Jayden Spencer @MrRandomist

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State of the Flash Game Industry

Posted by MrRandomist - August 3rd, 2012

I've seen a lot of posts and articles about the flash game market not being as lucrative as it once was, saying it was flooded and after all of that its now harder to get the same amount of money as what you used to for the same content.
This news makes me sceptical to release my games, and most likely anyone still making flash games as a possible market/job (even part time or just a hobby).

One of my unit co-ordinators that organises the games art course at my University says 'flash is dead its time to move on', so the Web Games and Design unit is now JavaScript intertwined with HTML5. Skipping all of the flash stuff (such as as3) as he says 'its completely dead, don't touch it any more'. This is quite frustrating as a flash dev, I understand the need to move to more secure grounded method for webgames and following and upwards trend and sure JavaScript is interesting and probably more useful in the long run.
However flash has a lot of other very useful things such as vector art? animations? the seemingly flow of new updates that will allow more and more HTML 5 output that is definitely to come? why can't we use that as a tool?

Back to the business side of things and the viewing perspective, have you noticed the once glorious newgrounds seemingly a thriving community now shirking into a very cult like group (exaggerating a little).
The amount of views that have once seen in the hundreds of thousands to millions of views on the frontpage to now just 10's of thousands of views.

What happened to the community, the casual viewers? have they gone to different websites? is it because everyone owns an iPhone and prefer to play byte sized games on there? or is it because schools and work places have crunched down on blocking flash game websites and video sites?

There so far seems to be only a downwards trend to flash games and websites such as Newgrounds, is it really time to move on completely from flash to HTML 5 games or other mediums? However im sure Newgrounds will support html 5 and other stuff soon enough, with Windows 8 and the new Internet Explorer having no plug-ins as examples.
I guess we'll wait and see, I wonder how the kids will break into the industry over the next decade? creating those awesome dress up games.

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DieterTheuns 2012-08-03 14:18:22

Eh, I've heard the same thing being said all the time, but I enjoy working in Flash. They're looking at it in a purely commercial way, if you like making games in it, then by all means, keep doing it. The most important factor is that you have fun.

Whilst it is true Flash isn't having the hottest of times at the moment, there are still great exceptions. Games from Edmund McMillen for example are selling like sweetcakes. It's all about how you tackle the distribution.

MrRandomist 2012-08-03 14:18:22 (Updated 2012-08-03 14:48:33)

I enjoy flash for its vector tool set, its great. Flash as a program is a whole other story though.
Its inspiring seen Edmunds games essentially made in flash or has that effect i.e. style being sold in the dozens (also seen in games like castle crashers and blocks that matter).

So rather than using flash player/internet distribution as a method should we then use the iPhone method/possible html 5 conversion? or using it as a tool set for a comercial game should we not learn some aspect of flash for say menu's, UI or Prototypes? as at the uni im at its being completely cut as a tool (set) to learn.

molkman 2012-08-03 17:41:41

Flash isn't dead and JavaScript sucks donkey balls. Seriously, what other plugins runs web games as smooth as Flash RIGHT NOW? Of course Unity is around the corner. But JavaScript won't be a contender and HTML5 will need another few years.

Only because Flash doesn't run on iPhones means nothing. Seriously, Flashgames that you play in a browser on a desktop computer never ran on Androids either, so there has never been an opportunity for Flash to work for smartphones. Only optimized games make it to smatphones.

MrRandomist 2012-08-03 17:41:41

I dont see flash as dead but rather just a spread in the market, however because of all these integers that flash has seemingly been hit by, we dont need to study it any more. As I mentioned.

JavaScript has its uses, and I've had to use it for a few things in Unity such as menus. Although there are obvious other ways to go around it. Although that being said JavaScript can go to hell.

As with any game going from say the wii to ps3 you'd need to optimize it for its control scheme, specs etc. Its the same as going from a desktop version of flash to the android or iphone version.

Starogre 2012-08-03 20:51:04

yeah social media sharing sites have taken up a lot of peoples' time nowadays. its sad to see but meh..

but also remember -

there once was a time where people submitted stuff to newgrounds not expecting any money to be made

MrRandomist 2012-08-03 20:51:04 (Updated 2012-08-04 05:10:21)

mmm, I see your point as to people now going to facebook rather than newgrounds. However there are thousands of other sites still with a thriving community.

I still see that time, when I submit a game to Newgrounds I don't expect any money back from this particular website (other than if I do submit with say Mochi ads) I love(d) the communities feedback, i believe it as one of the only places you'll get some really quality feedback and I usually take it to heart than say something posted on Kongregate (where its usually this game is crap or this game is cool).

Tyler 2012-08-03 21:35:52

I dont know, quality content still gets the views eventually since anything posted on this site (that isn't sitelocked) gets spread all over the internet pretty quickly. There are just a ton of game sites now and its players are so widely spread. Views will happen regardless.

I don't think flash is quite done yet. If one were to keep producing somewhat quality content and stand out above all the trash flash games, I'd say there are still a few short years left of making money. That being said, still a great idea to jump on incoming development trends and stay ahead.

For your comment about not wanting to release your games, why not? Are you making games because you want to, or just to make money? Release them for fun. Also, its still a relatively easy way to prototype a game concept quickly before committing to a larger project.

MrRandomist 2012-08-03 21:35:52

So is it because there are so many thousands of portals flooding the internet that we no longer go to Newgrounds? I know quality will essentially = views which means more distribution.

I believe Flash still has the less and if Adobe can push out other means of output to say HTML 5 that flash will have much longer legs. One things for sure though, I'd like to see the connection of OUYA and flash games. If OUYA does continue to be successful beyond its initial kick starter push, which is probably the newest development trend for the indies.

Its not that I dont want to release flash games its that im skeptical to continue to create/release them, as for example people that live and breath in the online space, that study it and teach it no longer see it as a teaching source and would rather now teach HTML 5 and JavaScript over flash and as3.

Its not that I'm just making flash games for the money, its that I want it as a future. To use its tool set for what I want to do. I dont want to work for the big companies adjusting the noses of the Football player for the next release of Fifa. I want to be release games that I want to play, and getting money from these games will obviously allow me to do this as a career. I understand no one should just use flash to as their sole money making job and it will most likely not be sustainable. But im hoping you understand that I love the tools flash provides (the program is another question) and making games is what Ive been studying and want to do as a future full time job.

OmarShehata 2012-08-04 05:17:00

This "news" and the statement "flash is dead, don't touch" are complete and utter bullshit.

The flash industry is by no means dead. In fact I'd argue there's a lot more money in it than before. How often would you hear about a game getting above $20k or $40k in revenue 3 years ago? There's actually more such games now, people just tend to not be very vocal about their financial details.

It's true that it's harder to get the same amount of money with the same game now, because flash games are getting *better*. So the people that are saying that it's hard to make money with flash just need to raise their standards and make better games. Right now, the money in flash is geared more towards the top end games, and the rest of the above average and average games don't get too much. This is basically similar to how other markets work such as the iOS appstore.

Flash isn't dying simply because, it's the fastest, most streamlined way to make web games at this moment, and there's no better alternative than that on the market. Unity and HTML5/Javascript are nice and everything, but I think it would suffice to point to the last Ludum Dare game jam. Out of the 1,400 games submitted, the games made with flash were almost always better than games made with...anything else. Most games made with Unity or Javascript were unfinished or small or just not that good, and it's understandable because it was only 48 to 72 hours. But the fact that you could produce a finished game with flash in such a short time means it's really really good for rapid prototyping.

I don't think flash will be going anywhere any time soon. It may take years and years for other kinds of web games to start getting traction, but even then, flash is extremely useful for other stuff as you mentioned.

Did you know that Castle Crashers was made with heavy use of flash? In fact all the art was made in flash, as vector art, and I remember hearing they even used Actionscript as a scripting language for their engine. This is why the game is massive and has a ton of animations and art, but the whole thing is around 150 mb.

Despite flash's drawbacks, it is by far the best framework I've seen for rapidly producing games. It's like a game maker but minimal limitations, and can be extended to work with whatever you want to do.

MrRandomist 2012-08-04 05:17:00

Its definitely true that games now days on the high end scale make more money/are very lucrative in terms of profit. However because of the flood of games that came the average game dont get as much as they would have in terms of quality/year on year ratio. I'm gonna go in and say this flood/better quality and lesser quality in terms of needing to work harder and make better games is because of AS3 to AS2 conversion as Squidly said flash became more of a game making tool rather than an animation one (i.e. the common use banners and ads).

The ludum dare is an interesting stat, I remember hearing about the most games being submitted with flash but not about them being better. thats great to hear :D

Don't forget team meats games, basically all flash.
Whats most intriguing is that what most people dont seem to see is that flash seems to have all these games mentioned (mostly through squidly) and they all seem to have this particular style and that people say its dead. Maybe its just as Ive said somewhere the big/popular developers have moved on from the internet space to the digital distribution i.e. iOS and Steam (or live/psn on the rarity)

OmarShehata 2012-08-04 05:18:25

So no, flash is not dead, and you can expect your games to make money. But only if you can expect this same game to make money on the mobile market. That's a bit of a hyperbole but you get the point.

MrRandomist 2012-08-04 05:18:25

I do, I guess the thing is to stay ahead of the curb and try to get stuff on Steam/iOS until the next thing comes along. The problem is not making a little bit of money from some flash games but rather to have this sort of market as a sustainable future/career for myself and other flash based indie devs.

I'll probably go down with ship's last breath, but all this unity/HTML5/JavaScript/big companies can mostly go to hell. long live indie. haha.

squidly 2012-08-04 06:03:06

I talked to Tom about this at PAX, this was shortly before he made the post asking if he should go for Venture Capitol.

Well, no, he shouldn't.

Yes, flash is dying, but it's mostly dying because:
A. People are convinced it's dying.
B. Flash is succesful... On facebook.
C. Facebook games are dying.

So yep, there's your thunder.

There's games like Robot Unicorn Attack, which simply exploded in popularity.
And Tetris Battle, which I routinely play.
How about everything from Zynga?

Yea, all flash.

However, the issue with Flash is that Adobe seems too keen to let go. With AS2 - AS3, flash literally started becoming "another programming language" as opposed to what it is, and then HTML5 came with it's "canvas," and the whole thing went to hell.

The problem is, Indie Games are now being produced en masse.
It used to be that Indie was practically synonymous with flash, but you find games like Terraria... And they're not. How about Spelunky? Minecraft? Cthulhu Saves the World? Hell, even Castle Crashers wasn't made on flash.

Even more so, people's sense of humor is different.

Flash Movies are still popular... On youtube. But people can't tell if it's flash, even though it clearly is (ASDF was done in flash, Laz0r collection, a lot of CollegeHumor videos, How it Should Have Ended, you name it.)

However, without that tagline or people actually PROMOTING the fact that it's in flash, well, tough luck.

The essence of flash is that it allowed both games AND movies, it was an animation tool that allowed coding - AS3 removed the animation aspect, basically, by making it all surface level stuff, just like Java and the like. With AS2, you could TELL you were operating with an animation tool.

Hey, maybe that's a bad thing.

Maybe it's a good thing, too.

MrRandomist 2012-08-04 06:03:06

I'm finding it hard to comment on your post haha.
But what I see is that people saw flash rise to its metaphorical peak a couple years back and because its not getting that same amount of scope as it used to, i.e. facebook games are dying and i'd also put that people arent releasing on its normal web output but rather on iphone or even with steam that the big devs arent using it as just an internet stream of content.
There also the fact that flash isnt just being used, there's lots of other programs out there stencyl, flash punk, flixel which are flash based, however not exactly flash.

I still find it so out of perspective, that its crazy we (and mostly likely lots of other places) dont get taught flash through college or uni because its considered dead. sure I learnt it myself, but how about all the students going through now not having been taught the program. the new generation of game devs wont even consider it as program to make games on!

ViolentAJ 2012-08-07 03:52:32

It is a good idea to start learning HTML 5, but don't give up on Flash just yet. It still facilitates animation and game design. even if Flash is dying, it is not close to its deathbed. Yes, it is harder to make money with Flash games, but it is still possible. I don't put my eggs in the Flash game basket anymore (never got great at making them to make the big money anyway), but it is still a monetized hobby of mine that has bolstered my income.

MrRandomist 2012-08-07 03:52:32

gotta love the new sprite sheet in cs6, it'll be great using it next to html5 and JS, for the rest of the year. Flash is probably not a great source of income as a whole, which is why its great that it can export as iphone/andriod which could potentially be great money! however with anything it still needs optimizing. which ive learnt is the same with html 5 game going cross browser >_> although thats a different topic.

eatmeatleet 2012-11-26 12:22:02

Hmmm, I haven't noticed any decrease of people from the NG Audio Portal. Can't tell about other places. I think it's a problem that concept of NG hasn't changed much for a long time.

The real portal rework probably had to have integrated facebook comments or some shit that should have been done years ago because the website uses kinda old-ish model.

Not sure about the flash is dying. I don't know what is Unity but if there is hype that flash is dying people will be rushing to learn html5 even though it is not up to par... I believe in such case there will be made some really great frameworks for game production .. Adobe proved to be a pretty adaptable company, they will learn and will probably adapt Flash suites to make html5 games at that point if they really have to.

Sorry I am not knowledgable in this topic but I hope you understand.

Take care

MrRandomist 2012-11-26 12:22:02

maybe its one generation not leading the other into newgrounds as a lot of people have come and gone but no replaced them so to speak....

unity is a game engine like say the unreal engine...

well actually they have something recenetly developed called edge for html5 stuff, it seems to do some cool stuff and makes some of the html5 hard code stuff more designer-y and visual based, which is cool:
http://html.adobe.com/edge/
http://www.forbes.com/sites/antho nykosner/2012/09/25/adobe-announc es-amazing-suite-of-html5-tools-i n-bid-to-merge-open-source-and-pr ofit/

you also take care you

State of the Flash Game Industry

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